Joe Knows Best?
Joe Paterno has been the Penn State Head Football Coach longer than many of us have been breathing. Because of this, many believe he should never be questioned nor his decisions challenged. Today I feel the need to call Joe out in regards to the punishment of Andrew Quarless.
Laschout.com has learned that as of now, Quarless is expected to sit out until the Michigan game. To me this seems utterly ridiculous when compared with Paterno's handling of other players that have run into trouble with the law. How can you sit a player for three games because of an underage drinking offense when you have players with felony charges against them not missing a snap? Did Tony Johnson sit for three games when he was arrested for DUI? Heck no. In fact, Paterno had this to say in regards to Johnson back in October 2003, "It's a bunch of kids going through the college experience and they do something stupid," "He didn't do anything to anybody," and, "I don't think you really, really look at it and say, 'How bad is this?'" Now granted there could be more to this story. Perhaps Quarless had some issues in the past that have warranted this suspension. However on the surface this suspension seems to be harsh and unfair when compared to Joe's past discipline history.
In my opinion, Quarless let his team down, but so did Anthony Scirrotto and Chris Baker. How is this worse than Tony Johnson getting behind the wheel of a car drunk? Why is Quarless being held to a higher standard than his teammates and past players with similar problems? Those are questions that only Joe Paterno can answer.
As for me I believe a one game suspension is warranted. Andrew should sit and watch his teammates against FIU and understand there are consequences for every action. But to sit the young man for three games while others with more serious transgressions play, just doesn't ring true to me. So Joe if you are reading this article over your afternoon lunch (and I'm sure you are) take some friendly advice. Let Andrew Play. After all, he's just a kid going through the college experience and doing something stupid. How bad is that?
Laschout.com has learned that as of now, Quarless is expected to sit out until the Michigan game. To me this seems utterly ridiculous when compared with Paterno's handling of other players that have run into trouble with the law. How can you sit a player for three games because of an underage drinking offense when you have players with felony charges against them not missing a snap? Did Tony Johnson sit for three games when he was arrested for DUI? Heck no. In fact, Paterno had this to say in regards to Johnson back in October 2003, "It's a bunch of kids going through the college experience and they do something stupid," "He didn't do anything to anybody," and, "I don't think you really, really look at it and say, 'How bad is this?'" Now granted there could be more to this story. Perhaps Quarless had some issues in the past that have warranted this suspension. However on the surface this suspension seems to be harsh and unfair when compared to Joe's past discipline history.
In my opinion, Quarless let his team down, but so did Anthony Scirrotto and Chris Baker. How is this worse than Tony Johnson getting behind the wheel of a car drunk? Why is Quarless being held to a higher standard than his teammates and past players with similar problems? Those are questions that only Joe Paterno can answer.
As for me I believe a one game suspension is warranted. Andrew should sit and watch his teammates against FIU and understand there are consequences for every action. But to sit the young man for three games while others with more serious transgressions play, just doesn't ring true to me. So Joe if you are reading this article over your afternoon lunch (and I'm sure you are) take some friendly advice. Let Andrew Play. After all, he's just a kid going through the college experience and doing something stupid. How bad is that?
Quarless' big transgression wasn't drinking, it was being out past 3 a.m. with a team meeting scheduled for a few hours later. This was made worse by the previous bad publicity. If you know the spotlight is on, stay low!
If Joe had listened to everyone questioning his judgment on discipline matters, Rashard Casey wouldn't have played his senior season.
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He made a bad decision no doubt about it. In my mind it is no worse than the decision made by Scirroto and Baker.
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The team was given a hearty, zero tolerance warning and Quarless ignored it.
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Bingo,
Everyone on the team was told to keep low, shut their mouths and not do anything stupid.
What did he do? He was up at 3AM drinking with his buddies..
I would have cleared out his locker too. There is no room for that at PSU; this is not Miami or OSU
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Penn State is no better than any other college out there. One only needs to check the police blotter to know that. PSU fans needs to get off their high horse. You would think the past 5-7 years would have done that, but a few still think we are lily white.
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Who the hell is we? What real fan of PSU believes we are like every other school?
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There is more beneath the surface than just this one incident.
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17,
We both know there's more to this than is out there for the public, and this isn't the first time Joe and Andrew have had a run in, but as I said on FOS, this too isn't abnormal, many kids have bumped heads with Joe.
I agree it's too severe, but PSU also should be able to beat FIU, ND, and Buffalo without him. I never felt PSU was going to beat Michigan with or without Quarless.
Now, my question to you is....So he's re-instated after the Michigan game (as I felt in the previous blog entry)...is he buried so far down the depth chart that he really doesn't see meaningful PT til week 8 or so? Or does Joe say, you've served your penalty and you are the best player at the position and slide him back to starting for Illinois?
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As of now I think he'll be back for Michigan and play (not start) right away. Knowing Joe, I won't be shocked if I see #10 on the field vs ND.
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It's joe...anything is possible.
Joe could go to Quarless and tell him to clean up the whole upper deck, and if he does, and works hard enough in practice he could get on the field for ND.
Or Joe could be stubborn, and prove a point to Quarless by sitting him in the 2 biggest games of the season.
Right now I'd be on the latter more than the former, but I wouldn't be stunned if it's the former.
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There's a world of difference between sitting out "UNTIL the Michigan game" and "AFTER the Michigan game." Here's hoping for the former!
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Quarless showed a total lack of respect to the coaching staff and program by getting arrested. If you noted what Dan Connor said regarding the situation, Quarless' real transgression was "sneaking out" and breaking curfew. Where does his committment lie....to himself having fun or the football program?
He made a mistake and now he has to pay for it. I actually have no problem with him sitting for the first three games, although I doubt he will.
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Didn't AS and Baker do the same thing? Should they not receive a similar punishment?
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Nope, they didn't do the same thing. They were involved in a "spur of the moment" incident which started with Scirrotto simply walking down the street.
Quarless and Harriot were already breaking one team rule before they got arrested for breaking the law. And this was after the entire team was told anyone who got in trouble was gone.
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I respectfully disagree, 17. Considering Dan Connor sat for 3 1/4 games for prank calling Joe Sarra, I really don't have a problem with Quarless getting similar treatment for his selfish behavior. To me, getting busted at 2 AM smack dab in the middle of fall friggin' football camp shows a level of stupidity, selfishness, carelessness that can't be brushed off if the TEAM is going to reach its goals. If this incident happened during the offseason I'd say make him run a few extra laps and that would be it. I suspect Joe would feel the same way. But the circumstances here are different, aren't they? I was told some very firm rules were established after the Scirrotto melee. If true, Joe had no choice but to act harshly re: AQ. Let's just hope the young man takes some time to get his head screwed on straight and dedicates himself to the team. He has a world of potential.
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If the comparisons suggested were made in a vacuum, I would tend to agree with your position. Unfortunately, Quarless does not = T.Johnson does not = Tom Bill does not = B. Engram does not = R. Sayles...etc. Paterno and staff ARE in the best position to deliver discipline that is fair and appropriate under each individual circumstance, IMO, because they do know the background, history and past transgressions (or lack there of) in each individual case.
Great Blog BTW. Love it.
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17- You KNOW there are other incidents, yet you still insist on writing this inflammatory article castigating JoePa.
This is a cheap shot designed to get posters mad at Joepa to fulfill an agenda
Sporty- I was encouraged to hear the quote from paterno saying "maybe 3 or 4 games". That would suggest that Quarless can get some rust out before the Michigan game if he is a good citizen and shows sincere contrition.
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Fill us in.......what's the agenda? From what I've seen, 17 has at least been consistent in his opinion on this topic from day 1.
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LionLover... I know there are "rumors" of past incidents, none of which have ever been confirmed. As for this article it's my opinion and what I believe. It's ridiculous that Quarless is being given a 3 game sit down while the "wrecking crew" isn't going to miss a snap. What agenda do you think I'm trying to serve with this article?
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I'll play along, what would the benefit be LL?
Funny thing is LL, if you truly believe there was an agenda, you just served it by posting on the matter.
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Come on Lyon you know what this is all about. Stern, myself and a few others won't be satisfied until Paterno is fired and we have run the PSU program into the dirt. Some folks take things way too seriously and give us way too much credit.
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I always thought that Sir Stern had it in for Joe because Joe is younger than Sir Stern!
I kid I kid HS.
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Having raised three children, I can attest to the fact that effective punishments are suited to the individual.
Our society's judicial system is of the same opinion.
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Absolutely, which is why the Joe Paterno felt a one game suspension would not have gotten AQ2's attention on this.
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Compare that to Troy Smith getting caught accepting money. He sat 1 whole game the 1st year. Regardless of what punishment Quarless gets, at of about 115 other Div 1A schools, he would be sitting the 1st half of the 1st game and that is it.
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That is because it was Ohio State. Smith would have been kicked off the team at PSU.
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The better comparison is to Clausen. His head coach exonerated him by saying even he didn't know what the law was.
Pathetic.
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Joe got soft a few years back, with Tony Johnson being the example. He quickly learned that it was destroying the program. I am glad Joe changed his tune back in 2004, by being the law, and not the coddling/enabling head coach.
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Excellent point Dutchman.
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I agree with you. But what is good for the goose is good for the gander. You can't have players with felony charges against them not sitting for a snap while a kid who broke curfew and got underage sits for 3 games. Joe needs to be consistent and I don't see that happening.
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You know as well as I do that the felony charges have a less than 0% chance of sticking.
I think Paterno is being consistent here. He's handled this situation exactly how he handled the Rashard Casey and Anwar Phillips situation....both of whom were exonerated as I'm sure Scirrotto and Baker will be.
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I don't think that comparing Crime A to Crime B is appropriate here. It's relatively known that Quarless has a bit of a history with Joe, and this is Joe's way of checking AQ. I'm fine with that. The kid was f'ing around at three in the morning, during fall camp, a few hours before a team function. He has the ability to be one of the best tight ends ever at PSU, and I don't blame Joe for cracking down on the kid before he thinks he can get away with such nonsense.
The Scirrotto/Baker issue is completely different, and is being handled poorly in terms of not suspending those guys for a game or two. That doesn't mean Joe's necessarily wrong for what he's doing to AQ.
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17 - I agree re Scirroto and Baker. How can they be playing on Saturday and Quarles sitting? I do not understand it.
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I really don't have a problem with AQ2's punishment, deserves it for no better reason then being very stupid
but I do think that its amazing that AS and baker get to play day1 compared to this offense.
LL- who are you going to cry too on this board? Doubt the mods hear will listen. Is there an ignore function here too?
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First off - I have no problem with your original blog FP. I think it's a valid opinion. I'm not sure what you're suggesting though - sit AQ less or sit AS & CB for a few games as well.
Dutchman - GREAT post. I think you very well may be on to something there.
Personally I think your both right. I think AQ's punishment should be a little more than what FP is suggesting, and a little less than the rumors. A 1.5 game suspension would mean AQ would not start for arguably one of the biggest games at the Beav in recent years. But the suspension is not so damning that it jeopardizes his development for the year (and in time for the MI game).
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NittanyL10N, just to clarify, I wrote this piece. The last thing I want is poor FP to get lynched for my opinion. I feel that all three should sit for the FIU game and then be allowed to work their way back into the lineup.
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DOHT! Sorry about that 17 and FP. FP had so many responses that I was naturally associating the blog entry with him. Either way - well written and some very good points. Thanks for the clarification on what you'd like to see happen. FWIW - I agree with you for the most part.
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I see it as being consistent. Warnings were given and not heeded. Transgression of the rules would be dealt with severely. The act, in and of itself, was minor. The disregard of the rules was not. I'm with Coach on this one.
But I'm curious, mind clarifying this "agenda" lionlover??
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The million dollar question was whether or not Joe actually had a meeting with the team after the AS meeting and told them to watch themselves.
If this did happen, then absolutely the punishment fits the crime since these 2 players decided to challenge the staffs authority.
Further, is Joe going to retroactively shorten the kid from Upper Darby's sentence of being kicked off the team and invited back to PSU? What about Cronin getting banished for essentially the season when he was foolish enough to get in trouble after one of Joe's team warnings.
If this team meeting had taken place, and Joe WASN'T severe it would certainly smack of favoritism because AQ is a starter and could certainly have lost the team.
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Where have most of you people been,AS and CB where both suspended and kicked off the campus. nether was allowed to practice or even be on campus, i would bet that Quarless is on campus and probally is allowed to at least practice with the team, or at least be allowed to stay around.
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AQ is with the team and practicing.
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I think Joe's response is excessive. However, it is clear that he wants to send a big message to Quarless and Harriot (mainly Quarless). Missing ND and possibly Michigan sends a huge message to not only Quarlss and Harriott but also to the rest of the team.
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Turning it around, what is worth if you look at it a certain way which may be how JoePa is looking at it.
AS -- walking downtown minding his own business. Some punks come up and harass him and hit him and his girlfriend. AS calls up some friends and explains what happened. They come down to protect him. Fight ensues.
AQ/WH - JoePa gives an ulitimatum before fall practice to keep your noses clean. AQ/WH get caught underage drinking (I think the 'drinking' part is more important than the 'underage' part), out after curfew.
To JoePa, breaking 2 team rules (drinking and out after curfew) is worse than AS getting in a fight with a guy who harassed him and sucker punched him and his girl.
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I'd agree with you if it was just AS involved. But about 15 guys showed, many barged into a party and at least a few guys assaulted kids within the party. I don't think the charges will ever stick but there is no question that at least a few guys swung fists(and bar stools).
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In Joe's thinking, a bunch of 18-22 year old kids getting in a fight when one of them (and his girlfriend) get sucker punched is bad, but understandable. The team rule they broke was fighting in the offseason (if that is a rule).
Breaking 2 team rules when JoePa reiterates the the importance of staying clean during fall camp is not understandable. Especially when JoePa thinks this team has the potential to be a Big Ten Champ.
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History has taught us that these things don't always turn out as first advertised. I don't have any inside info on this other than hearing some tidbits about other Quarless missteps, but I'd be surprised if he really didn't play at all until Mich.
Joe is trying to figure out what punishment will help both set the right example for the team as well has help the kid. He hammered Connor pretty hard , but in the long run it may have been a very good thing for Dan. Let's just sit tight and see what happens here. I also believe alot depends on how Quarless handles his time in the doghouse....
jmho
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AQ2's actions were a clear slap in the face to the coaches, the program, and his teammates. There are stupid things that happen, and then there is a blatant disregard for rules.... IMO he is getting what he deserves.
As for Scirotto and Baker, what they did was back in April and were expelled from school. Had it happened during fall practice, I'm sure they would be serving a suspension.
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There's no consistency for crimes in the NCAA as a whole, and Joe's not consistent either. 3 games for missing curfew/drinking etc is probably 2 games longer than it should be.
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Or one may some of the other infractions on other palyers have been to light. There are other things going on with AQ which caused the big penalty. Sometimes character issues or grades may go a long way in determining sentence.
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If there was something else going on with AQ2, then why would Harriot be sitting for the same amount of games. Look at the facts, Joe said no more trouble and they didn't listen. The 3a.m. time when they got caught was the biggest offense, no the drinking. What in the hell are they thinking being out at 3 in the morning when they had pratice in like 5 hours? There was a curfew and they broke it Period.
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I think people are jumping the gun just so they can have an argument. Here is Joe's exact quote. "Right now, neither one of them will play this week and they may not play for three or four weeks, I don't know yet."
Here is Joe's entire answer to the question about the status of AQ & Harriot.
"I don't know. Quarless and Harriott did something that really bothered me in the sense that they were out after hours when we were in camp. A preseason issue is a little different and it took a lot of discipline on the part of the squad because a lot of them were in school, including Quarless and Harriott, and they didn't really have a strict curfew, but we had told them when they had to be in. Right now, neither one of them will play this week and they may not play for three or four weeks, I don't know yet. I had told them both to get going and some of the kids on the team got together with the captains, (Terrell) Golden, (Dan) Connor and (Anthony) Morelli. They elected them captains; I didn't appoint them as was suggested by some people. They were elected. They said (to me), 'how about we let them back on and you do some other things to them,' and I said, 'well, okay.' So that's where we are. They're practicing with us, but they're not going to play for us (this week)."
No where does he say they will absolutely be out 3 to 4 weeks.
RELAX.
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True.
They won't be seen til 9/29 at the earliest IMHO.
Now if they bust their ass in practice Joe MAY let them suit up and play prior to Michigan, but I don't expect AQ to get any real serious PT until early-mid october.
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At the end of the day, I think AQ2 will have learned a very valuable lesson from his transgression and he appears to be a kid who Joe really likes. IMO losing AQ2 until before the Michigan game, could mean the difference in the ND game and perhaps even the Michigan game if he is rusty, as AQ2 is a playmaker. I hope he reacts to his punishment in the same way that Dan Connor did and becomes a leader for future teams.
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Hmmmm..... Connor got 3 games for prank phone calls, and that discipline seemed to work out well enough. Maybe AQ2 will shape up much the same. Better to get him whipped into team mode earlier than later.
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i like this site, but this article is moronic. he broke curfew and was cited just a few hours before a team function during summer practices. all this after the "incident", it was stupid and irresponsible. andrew left joe no choice in the matter.
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